This Week’s Influencer: Are Downloads Dead?; World Cup Scores Big With Podcast Audiences; iHeart Solves Radio Attribution?; and More…

For years, marketers have used downloads to help determine their podcast spend. But now that podcasts exist in so many different formats and spaces—from long-form Netflix videos to short-form YouTube Shorts clips to live shows—it’s harder than ever to determine audience size. With so many platforms in play, how can creators know exactly what they’re selling?  More importantly, how can buyers know what they’re getting?

This week, Dan Granger (CEO & Founder, Oxford Road) hosts Steve Goldstein (Founder & CEO, Amplifi Media; Adjunct Professor, NYU) on Media Roundtable to talk about how $1-2B in additional growth can be unlocked if we ditch downloads and create a new universal and consistent metric.

Want the DL on downloads? Join Dan and Steve as they debate new methods of measurement and discuss what buyers need to be paying attention to as podcasting moves into its next phase.

“The money is going to flow to where the audience is. We have the audience. We have great shows…If we can verify the audience and present it in a unified sort of way, that’s where we need to be.”  – Steve Goldstein (Founder & CEO, Amplifi Media; Adjunct Professor, NYU)

The Audience Wants It Both Ways – When it comes to audio vs. video, Steve notes that in numerous studies, audiences have made it clear they want to consume their podcasts wherever and however they can. Despite what  you might have heard, audio isn’t perishing, and video isn’t always an easy win. So, before you invest in a show, learn how its audience behaves and make sure there’s transparency about whether their audience is listening, watching, or both.

Downloads Don’t Work – We all know the download has become an unreliable metric, but just how unreliable is it? According to Steve, many shows inflate download counts by as much as 50 percent. That may be why some platforms are moving away from downloads altogether. As Steve puts it: “If more podcasts stream on Spotify, and YouTube’s not even in that business, then we’re really just talking about Apple [in terms of downloads]. And if Apple’s video initiative kicks in, they’ll be out of the download game.” So what will be the best metric in the post-download era? Steve and Dan both agree: it’s plays and streams, which means you should start thinking about how to negotiate buys around a new set of numbers.

Reach for High Value Content – Everyone agrees there’s simply too much content to contend with nowadays. Steve’s suggestion for navigating the glut: Focus on what he calls High Value Content, or HVC (which is not to be confused with HVAC School, a niche podcast about HVAC installation that Steve enjoys). Steve defines HVC podcasts as shows that instill long-term loyalty, even if fans don’t necessarily consume every single episode. “[It’s when] people say, ‘I enjoy spending time listening to Kara Swisher and Scott Galloway. But do I make it through every minute? No. I pick and choose.’” With increased competition, the shows that will prosper are the ones that build relationships with listeners and encourage them to come back out of habit.

For more deets on the download’s downfall, check out the full episode below.

The Classifieds

The Kids Are Alright, and Mom and Dad Are Telling All

Network: Backyard Ventures / Episodic Downloads: 35k

Given their busy schedules, it’s amazing that married superstars Keion and Shaunie Henderson have time for a podcast at all. Keion is the pastor of The Lighthouse Church; Shaunie is the creator and star of the long-running VH1 reality show Basketball Wives, and together, they have a blended family of six children. So there’s plenty for the couple to talk about on their weekly sitdown podcast, Grown & Growing by Keion and Shaunie Henderson.

Each episode finds the couple honestly and playfully discussing their lives in conversations that demonstrate the duo’s obvious mutual respect. Whether you’re a fan of Shaunie’s reality-TV persona or a member of Keion’s congregation, Grown & Growing is a truly heart-warming BTS look at their lives. The show is a great opportunity for advertisers who see high performance in the Relationships, Kid & Family, or Religion & Spirituality categories. If you’re married to a solid testing strategy, click below for more details.

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This Book Club Will Make You Dust Off That Library Card

Network: Audioboom / Episodic Downloads: 13k

The phrase “book club” might get book nerds excited, but group literary gatherings don’t always have the happiest endings. Sometimes the conversation gets stodgy, and sometimes the book turns out to be a dud. It is also hard to find a book that interests everyone in the group. Luckily, there’s a podcast for pop culture fans eager to dive into a great new book without having to head to someone’s house every Thursday.

Shelf Respect follows author Erin Moon, Knox McCoy and Jamie B. Golden, hosts of the popular podcast The Popcast With Knox and Jamie, as they discuss culture, art, and their love for literature, all with a light comedic touch. The show is a must-test for anybody already testing into The Popcast, as well as for those seeking female-skewing opportunities in the Art & Culture category. Put your bad testing practices on the shelf via the link below.

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In Case You Missed It

Don’t Pigeon-Hole Yourself Into Obvious Genre Alignment

Marketing Week reports that brands are turning to unexpected podcast categories to reach niche but highly engaged audiences. One example is the travel group Explore Worldwide, which turned to true crime podcasts to drive leads and purchases, demonstrating that brands and shows don’t always need to be an obvious match in order to work. This bigger lesson here is one that many in the podcasting industry have known for years: Namely, that podcast audiences have a wide variety of interests, and that advertisers can reach them across a wide range of genres. So, whether you’re looking at business, comedy, sports, wellness, true crime, or any number of categories, make sure you’re diversifying your buy, not just falling into the obvious plays.

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Podcasts + World Cup Fans = GOOOAAALLLL!

Edison Research’s Podcast Consumer 2026 finds podcast audiences over-index on sports fandom, or any fandom that is particularly passionate about the content that they’re consuming. According to the story, 55% of podcast fans are interested in the 2026 World Cup, with interest rising further among heavy podcast listeners (by comparison, 47% of the overall U.S. population has expressed interest in the World Cup). It stands to reason that podcasts would over-index among U.S.-based World Cup fans. Podcasts skew upscale, and so does soccer. Aligning with the World Cup through podcasts may not be actionable for every brand, but the numbers are further proof that podcasting remains a strong place to reach upscale, engaged international audiences.

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iHeart Makes a Game-Changing Play Regarding Radio Measurement

iHeartMedia launched AudioGraph, a new platform designed to bring digital-style targeting, planning, and attribution to broadcast radio. The platform uses privacy-safe identity data, TransUnion audience attributes, Triton Digital technology, and external measurement partners to help advertisers buy and evaluate radio beyond traditional age and gender demographics. iHeart says early tests outperformed demographic-based plans, with broader industry rollout scheduled for 2027. Radio attribution has moved from less-than-ideal solutions like time-series attribution to a growing set of effective options from Claritas, Podscribe, Magellan AI, and now iHeart. That is real progress, but marketers still need to be careful. The ideal solution is a method that can measure all of the audio activity in a single plan, not through a piecemeal method with a variety of partners.

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#SaveTheLiveReads

Tecovas Has This Host Hearing Wedding Bells While Walking Down the Aisle

Dillon Cheverere, David Ruff, and Will DeFries of the Circling Back podcast earn this week’s #STLR with a Tecovas endorsement that feels more like best friends giving recommendations than a sponsored segment. The standout moment? Will casually mentions that he got married in his Tecovas boots, a personal detail that turns a product promotion into a real-life use case.

From there, the conversation turns to weddings, ranch trips, festivals, and everyday wear, all of which demonstrate how Tecovas has become genuinely woven into their lifestyles. Throw in some playful banter about English soccer fans shopping for boots in Dallas, and you’ve got a read that’s funny, authentic, and packed with personality. This is brand alignment at its best: This read has us hearing wedding bells and checkout bells as customers go to add a new pair of boots to their carts.

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OXFORd In The News

Spotify Aligns With AMP on What a “Play” Actually Means

We covered it here last week, but it’s worth a reminder: Spotify for Creators made a huge announcement recently, with Podnews and Podcast Business Journal picking it up shortly after. Spotify officially redefined what counts as a “play” in its Creators dashboard, adopting the AMP framework’s 30-second threshold, once per user, per session, across both audio and video. Spotify is the first major platform to publicly align with the standards AMP proposed, and while Spotify notes that its own data “helped inform” the definition, the direction of travel is clear. If you want to learn more about AMP’s goals, click HERE.

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Entertainment Podcasts Are a Better Bet Than Advertisers Think

Our latest June ORBIT ranking landed in Podnews and Podcast News Daily, with both outlets anchoring on the same finding: Entertainment and Media podcasts sit in the bottom-third of all genres for ad performance, but 15 shows consistently deviate from that trend. The data, drawn from over $1.8 billion in campaign spend across 500-plus advertisers, points to a clear pattern: niche-driven shows with engaged communities, particularly those built around TV, film, and female-skewing pop culture, outperform the genre average. The takeaway isn’t to avoid Entertainment; it’s to buy the show, not the label.

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